Gypsies - opinions and experiences?

[bigzee]

Guys,

in light of the current news item and last night's TV documentary about the Basildon "traveller" site eviction, I was wondering what the concensus of bushcraft opinion was on Gypsies and travellers.

There is a large part of me that wants to get behind that whole roaming and "living off the land" lifestyle, and also I don't like to get swept along on the knee-jerk reaction wave of public opinion (NIMBYs etc). However, my own observations from the countryside, and the media are that their lifestyle is far from ethically and environmentally pure like say the rainforest people or bushmen and native Americans.

What do you all think?

[Martin]

Guys, I personally think this thread is treading on very stony ground from the outset. It's a bit like asking the question, 'Asians - opinions and experiences?' or any other minority group. Now, I'm not some bleeding heart liberal but I'm not sure that the internet in general or NaturalBushcraft in particular are the places to be discussing this.

In the spirit of free speech, this thread won't be locked immediately but it will be monitored very closely and action will be taken if any inappropriate comments are posted.

Please play nicely people.

Martin

[Bernie]

I agree Martin. Vote to close.

[Silverback]

2 votes to close

[Thumbcrusher]

I don't have a problem with any group of people as long as they abide by the same planning application rules that everyone else has to. That's only being fair!

maybe the question should be "do we need planning rules in the countryside"?

[JonnyP]

I would love to spend time with some proper Gypsies and learn from them many things outdoor related. I find their way of life fascinating.
I do not like those travellers who leave their rubbish over the countryside and have no respect for anyone or any thing. That would apply to any person or peoples too.

[bigzee]

As they say in legal circles: "I withdraw that remark", and you may all hereby consider the subject closed.

[Ashley Cawley]

Thanks Martin for putting that point across better than I could :) ... I struggled on what to say frankly.

But one thing comes to mind; a quick thank you to all the community here for being such a nice bunch :o
Generally the community here always seems to be sensible & positive, we don't seem to have huge downward spirals like I see elsewhere and it makes it an enjoyable place to be (and easier to moderate!)

:camping:

[Martin]

May I add to my earlier comments that locking a thread is not something that is done lightly and I believe that debate is healthy.

However, there are some subjects, in this day and age, that are contentious and leave people open to prosecution. Let's face it, freedom of speech was lost some time ago with the introduction of various pieces of legislation.

My intention here is to distance NaturalBushcraft from any accusations of impropriety, not to stifle debate or freedom of speech.

Martin

[JEEP]

The Roma (from where I am from, gypsi is a degatory term) is a very diverse people - as diverse as any people.

[Dan XF]

We had a group of gypsies move on to a field near to us. When they left all that was left behind was a couple of large rubbish sacks tied tightly at the top. They moved on to a site in Reading that was formerly a carpark but by the time they got there it was a demolition site. The council gave them a couple of large skips and they tidied the place up so their kids could play safely. By the time they left a few weeks later it was cleaner than when they arrived. I guess proper gypsies do live by a code we dont necessarily understand but I've never had an issue with them. I've been out to gypsy sites as a Paramedic and they have been polite helpful and grateful for our assistance. I think they are often misunderstood and demonised by the press and public opinion. Don't get me started on travellers though, I have never had a good experience of them as a Paramedic or as a passer by or as a member of the community left to look across the eye sore they have left behind. That's my opinion and I'm sure it does not necessarily reflect the views of other forum members.

[Tony1948]

It look's like I'll have to watch wot I say.To start with the guys in Basildon are NOT GYPSIES,they are Irish Travellers.The true British Gypsie has been more or less intergreated into main stream around Essex for at lest two generation,They live in statick vans on cauncil run sites that are as kleen as there vans and houses and most of them have propper jobs.Gypsies and Irish Travellers dont mix and dont get on together althow they lived along side each other at Basildon, Gypsies in the council run site that is well looked after and next door to the old scrape yard that the Irish Travellers bought and then started to move in statick vans and mobiles with no legal service's or planning permison.I hope this post is not ofensive to any one,but thought its right to explain there is a differents between the too coalchers.Sorry about some of the spelling but I am old LoL and I did leve school at 14.......DONT GET EATEN BY THE BEARS...........TONY.

[luresalive]

I would love to spend time with some proper Gypsies and learn from them many things outdoor related. I find their way of life fascinating.
I do not like those travellers who leave their rubbish over the countryside and have no respect for anyone or any thing. That would apply to any person or peoples too.

Got to agree whole heartedly with Jonny on this one, true genuine gypsies would have a wealth of info we could all use, but there is a difference between those old characters and the few of those who have no respect these days

[comanighttrain]

People being people, some are good, some are ok and some ... well some we could do without.

My experience of travellers is limited. Mostly some fruitcake trying to sell me white heather. Why would you try to sell heather to a highlander? maybe she should start a business shipping ice to the inuit....

[J_P]

It look's like I'll have to watch wot I say.To start with the guys in Basildon are NOT GYPSIES,they are Irish Travellers.The true British Gypsie has been more or less intergreated into main stream around Essex for at lest two generation,They live in statick vans on cauncil run sites that are as kleen as there vans and houses and most of them have propper jobs.Gypsies and Irish Travellers dont mix and dont get on together althow they lived along side each other at Basildon, Gypsies in the council run site that is well looked after and next door to the old scrape yard that the Irish Travellers bought and then started to move in statick vans and mobiles with no legal service's or planning permison.I hope this post is not ofensive to any one,but thought its right to explain there is a differents between the too coalchers.Sorry about some of the spelling but I am old LoL and I did leve school at 14.......DONT GET EATEN BY THE BEARS...........TONY.

Spot on Tony.. we know better than most eh ;)

[Realbark]

I have a lot of experience with the travelling community (gypsy and traveller for those of you who wish to differentiate) as i have a family member who has been living with one for the past 8 years. As in all walks of life there are a lot of good people and also some scum. My own experiences have been mainly good - the same as in my normal community ( as always there are exceptions). I have in the recent past campaigned AGAINST unauthorised sites such as the one in the current media feeding frenzy. However i have also objected to my neighbours planning application in the past. There are ALWAYS difficult decisions to be made in life but they cannot be avoided just because the party concerned is of a different culture etc IMO.

[nat110732]

still on topic but slightly off, thought for a minute it said 'Gypsies-onions'.......opinions!!!

Nat:)

[Realearner]

Thanks Martin, your comment on free speech was spot on.
And long live democracy!,,,,,

[fish]

true roma are all but gone ,they were really nice decent folk,as for the tarmacking scrap collecting house dwelling oiks that call themselves travellers.....well just dont upset um nor befriend them youll regret both.

[Edwin]

There is the point that self-curtailment of free speech because it MIGHT be illegal or THEY are watching is the very short road to PC dictatorship.

I love the "Smoke in the Lanes" (book by Dominic Reeves) romantic free travelling and pulling up in a handy atchin tan to spend the days round an open fire and browsing off the countryside but see no point in a sedentary "travelling" lifestyle (ten year stays?) especially if it is illegally based.

I have had some potential hassle in my own bit of wood about whether I can even camp the legal 28 days a year there (shall do anyway though) which might bias me a bit.

[swkieran]

i feel sorry for the genuine ones i.e the roma,who are clean law abiding and hard working and stay on genuine camp sites,and ive met a few in my time,but the ones on dale farm fall into th catergory of new age travellers who are a menace anyone living in my area will know of the haldon forest encampment aswell lol,it's a mess,i dont like to see anyone evicted or put out in the street.another problem were are they all going to go when basildon council evict them,because it doesnt end there.in torbay a local farmer took matters into his own hands,because torbay council refused to do anything,year after year the travellers used to park up for a few months on common ground inbetween brixham and paignton,not this year because the fmr went down a week before they usually arrive and dug trenches around the site with his digger and men lol.http://www.thisisdevon.co.uk/Farmer-digs-trench-travellers/story-12828728-detail/story.html

[bigzee]

What?.....no downward spiral of racial hatred postings and social intolerance? I'll just have to hang up my pointy white hat and put the burning cross back in the garage then!

I guess you guys can be trusted to have intelligent adult discussion after all.

[Martin]

Fair point Bigzee but what just to fill you in with some statistics which may shed some light.

There are 4,258 members on this forum and, so far, the moderating team have banned 238 members. Admittedly, most of those have been banned for spamming but I can assure you that we have all had to mediate or moderate on several occasions because of intolerant, abusive or just plain nasty people. I fully agree with you that most members/users are good, honest, decent people but we have to legislate for the others. Sadly, they are out there and on here!!!

Martin