The state of the economy..

[JonnyP]

Whats are you're thoughts about the economy collapsing..? Many bankers and financial advisers think it is going to happen, so if it does, how will it all pan out..? How will it affect us..?
Quoted...
"Companies selling freeze-dried food rations, sealed in giant air-tight multi-serving tins and with a shelf-life of 25 years, have seen sales soar in recent months — increasing ten-fold compared to previous years.
Most popular are the packs of instant meals that will keep a family of four going for three months once water is added. At around £1,500 they are not cheap. But many of those buying these emergency rations see them as a wise investment — and they are well-placed to make such a judgment.
‘It is not “crazies” buying this,’ says James Blake, whose company Emergency Food Storage specialises in freeze-dried foods. ‘We get a lot of high-powered business people as customers. Most people buy insurance for their health, their house or their life — this is food insurance.
‘Of course, we hope it never happens, but if there is a major catastrophe, then money is not going to be worth much after a couple of days. It will be food that becomes the most needed thing.’
Dave Hannah and his company B-Prep sell similar products. He says a number of his customers are bankers. Their average spend is £3,000."

This is not just survivallists buying up, this is bankers getting ready. I got that quote from the Daily Mail mind, but its interesting reading.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2075371/Stocking-Doomsday-As-economists-predict-meltdown-meet-families-ready-worst.html

Anyone one here stocking up..?
Anyone worried, or is it carry on as normal..?

[Silverback]

A friend in the US says there is a definate increase in activity and interest in subjects like wartime menus, food rationing and sustainable living.

[luresalive]

It's not a case of "be prepared" but rather "be sensible", massive hoarding of food stuffs etc is not necessary for the forseeable future, the world economy will not collapse, there will be no zombie invasion. However there may very well be a period of economy slow down and a global depression/recession but as we came out of that before we will do so again...Get Cody Lundins book,it's a very sensible precautionary essay on what to stock up on and how to manage if things go pear shaped..

[JonnyP]

Well we just bought a big bag of spuds, and a big bag of onions, so we will be ok..
How can you say there will be no collapse, when many experts in that field are predicting it Lures..?
And why is it that any teotwawki discussion, the word zombie comes up.. The economy of the World is not looking good, thats a fact. Zombies are myth

[luresalive]

Brother,it was looking even worse in the 20's and 30's and we came out of that, we overcame the black death,world wars, famines and pestilences, it simply won't happen with a simple recession.

[Metal mug]

Dave Hannah and his company B-Prep sell similar products. He says a number of his customers are bankers. Their average spend is £3,000.

Ha ha. :) The bankers b******d up the economy. I suppose it makes sense that they'd be prepared for the worst. :D

[bigzee]

Ha ha. :) The bankers b******d up the economy. I suppose it makes sense that they'd be prepared for the worst. :D

That would be "Merchant bankers" in the cockney rhyming sense I assume?

[Silverback]

with a gun you can rob a bank...............with a bank you can rob the world!!

[Metal mug]

with a gun you can rob a bank...............with a bank you can rob the world!!The funniest thing I've heard for a while. :D

[Realearner]

with a gun you can rob a bank...............with a bank you can rob the world!!

Fantastic quote, love it :evilgrin:

[JonnyP]

Brother,it was looking even worse in the 20's and 30's and we came out of that, we overcame the black death,world wars, famines and pestilences, it simply won't happen with a simple recession.

We have and always will overcome things, but how can you say there will be no collapse, when many experts in that field are predicting it Lures..?
Btw, I am just raising the question.

Love the quote MM

[luresalive]

They said the Y2K virus would paralyse the online world,it didn't happen..they said the Bird flu Virus would kill 50 million worldwide, it didn't happen, they said swine flu would infect 40% of the UK population,it didn't happen..the one thing you can be sure is the "experts" will get it wrong, just like Global warming,it's all sabre rattling,don't buy into the hype.
The thing we should be worried about is war with Iran.

[JonnyP]

They said the Y2K virus would paralyse the online world,it didn't happen..they said the Bird flu Virus would kill 50 million worldwide, it didn't happen, they said swine flu would infect 40% of the UK population,it didn't happen..the one thing you can be sure is the "experts" will get it wrong, just like Global warming,it's all sabre rattling,don't buy into the hype.
The thing we should be worried about is war with Iran.
You are talking about totally different things there.. Just because people will get things wrong, doesn't mean they will always be wrong. Is that the only reason why you say there will be no collapse..?

[luresalive]

You are talking about totally different things there.. Just because people will get things wrong, doesn't mean they will always be wrong. Is that the only reason why you say there will be no collapse..?

I don't think I am talking about different things, I just don't buy into the hype anymore, I'm too old and too cynical to believe scare mongering, and there is ALWAYS scaremongering about something! I guess the only way you will know for sure is to wait and see....

[JEEP]

If everyone panicked and started buying survival gear and -food, it would actually be a major boost to the echonomy. Thus possibly preventing said breakdown.

[JonnyP]

I don't think I am talking about different things, I just don't buy into the hype anymore, I'm too old and too cynical to believe scare mongering, and there is ALWAYS scaremongering about something! I guess the only way you will know for sure is to wait and see....
That we will..



If everyone panicked and started buying survival gear and -food, it would actually be a major boost to the echonomy. Thus possibly preventing said breakdown.

There is so much irony in that, that even Americans would get it..
(that is not having a pop at Americans I hasten to add, just going on the understanding that Americans do not get irony)

[HedgeComber]

The financial world is looking incredibly shaky, and if anything did go wrong on a national/international scale, a plausible outcome would be temporary food shortages or at the very least, steep price increases. I don't see any scare mongering or zombie threats in that, just common sense.

To buy excess of your regular (long life) foods and squirrel them away for times when money/work and therefore food is tight, is just sensible home economics.

Loved the comment form the guy buying tins of baked beans when he doesn't even like them!

[Ben Casey]

What normally happen in financial crisis is they have the odd world war it sorts out the over population and gets the ecconomies going :)

[rossbird]

I laughed when I saw the well stocked freezer, not sure that's the best way to stock up!
I tend to agree with Luresalive, this isn't the first or last depression the world will encounter.
Always reminds me of a volcano, we never know when the major one will happen.
Anyway I'm off to Tesco's to buy a few tins:confused2:

[Silverback]

What normally happen in financial crisis is they have the odd world war it sorts out the over population and gets the ecconomies going :)

Theres plenty of past events in the history books to confirm this theory too

[Silverback]

I tend to agree with Luresalive, this isn't the first or last depression the world will encounter.


Sure, but will you be one of them that makes it out of the other side ? By having a little foresight and some knowledge and skills (not necessarily building a butter mountain) you can improve your chances.

[JonnyP]

I laughed when I saw the well stocked freezer
Yeah, and also that they had their names and faces on there.. Guess where all their friends and neighbours will be going if it does all go Pete Tong.. lol

[Silverback]

Yeah, and also that they had their names and faces on there.. Guess where all their friends and neighbours will be going if it does all go Pete Tong.. lol

Did you see the bottles of bollinger champagne ? Lifes little comforts eh, like the fresh meat in the freezer - :happy-clapping:

[SJT]

Sounds like dry food companies are playing on worries. Lursealive is right the depression in early part of 20th century was worse. We'll probably see some countries drop out of EU sometime next year and then EU will be much stronger.

[rossbird]

Sure, but will you be one of them that makes it out of the other side ? By having a little foresight and some knowledge and skills (not necessarily building a butter mountain) you can improve your chances.

Know what your saying Sapper, for now, I'm concentrating on finding enough work to pay the bills. This will help me build up my resources ( Tools, equipment etc)
Already have several localities for a base....should the need arise.
I wonder how long the natural resources in a small country like ours, would sustain a reasonably sized population?

[Silverback]

Know what your saying Sapper, for now, I'm concentrating on finding enough work to pay the bills.

Amen to that brother, I'm in the same boat myself. I also have a couple of places to scoot to...one has its own well and is well stocked with stuff. Knowledge is free and worth its weight in gold whilst work is thin on the ground I'm making myself aufait with new skills and honing some old ones.

[Martin]

There will be no 'collapse'. The 'economy' is what people buy and sell, not what the stock exchange values companies at.

No matter how much the press tries to talk things down and into a depression we all have to buy things including accomodation, food, clothing, fuel and other essentials and most people want to buy luxury items like cars, televisions, white goods etc as well as leisure purchases like restaurants, cinema, theatre etc. The vast majority of people in the western world are in employment and have disposible income which they will spend. You may not be able to afford to do some of these things but many many people can and do.

My company is enjoying its second successive record year of sales and we are allied to the building industry. I was in a design and shopfitting business in Somerset today and they are doing so well that they have just moved into larger premises about double the size of their old premises. I asked if business was good and they said that it was and that retailers are spending big money on shopfittings to bring their businesses up to date.

Yes, things are tough at the moment for many people. I am earning less, in real terms, than I was three years ago but I still have to spend and so does everyone else.

Don't believe the propoganda which is being spread by the press.

Martin

[Silverback]

There will be no 'collapse'.

I dont believe the hype....... I'm just seeing it with my own eyes and hearing it from my mates who are losing their jobs.

Try coming up North, it will open your eyes.

Recently a company here advertised 2 vacancies, they got over 600 applicants. Our high street is almost empty, there is very little new build in construction, either residential or commercial.....

Never mind the Olympics will bail us all out of the sh*t

[luresalive]

What normally happen in financial crisis is they have the odd world war it sorts out the over population and gets the ecconomies going :)

That is absolutely correct..which is why I mentioned Iran.

[Bambii]

I really can't see the whole world collapsing from a recession.

[Silverback]

I really can't see the whole world collapsing from a recession.

No but look what happened following the last big one...an Austrian painter and decorator changed the course of history and cost 30+ million people their lives.

I think thats what luresalive is alluding to

Look at the effect war has on the civillian population. Even as a major power in the 40's our population experienced hardship because of the effects of politics & economics.

[happybonzo]

The Eurozone is not looking good. There has been financial mismanagement on an absurd scale.
When I travelled through France earlier this year I thought that the country looked very down. When I visited any hypermarkets, the concessionaire shops looked empty with little trade going on. In the small villages and towns it was rare to see people going about their normal business. Prices were very much higher than in 2010 and yet shops still closed on Sunday and even Monday.
Property prices are similarly depressed. When I queried one place that I was interested in at €395k I was told to try €300k because all the majority of people on this particular agents books were desperate to sell. I didn't go for it as it was right on a main road; that wasn't mentioned in the literature that I got from the estate agent otherwise it was perfect in every respect.
Something that you never used to see in France were cars with "for sale" signs printed up on a PC stuck in the windows: You do now.
I needed a chainsaw while I was there and it's not the sort of thing I usually take away with me. I had to pay some 25% more than I would in the UK and we're not the cheapest place to buy items.
Friends of mine who moved to Spain and Portugal tell me that things are pretty grim for a lot of ex-pats.
No, I think that 2012 is going to be interesting for a number of countries such as Eire, Greece, Spain, Portugal, Italy, France and also the old Eastern Bloc countries. The gravy train has hit the buffers. It just remains to be seen how much of the fall out affects the UK

[rossbird]

The Eurozone is not looking good. There has been financial mismanagement on an absurd scale.

No, I think that 2012 is going to be interesting for a number of countries such as Eire, Greece, Spain, Portugal, Italy, France and also the old Eastern Bloc countries. The gravy train has hit the buffers. It just remains to be seen how much of the fall out affects the UK

Agree with all this.
As Martin stated earlier, our economy is based on what we buy and sell.
Much of our trade is within the EU, so we will feel some of the shock-waves emanating from there.

[Dan XF]

I think most people nowadays would struggle if Dominos or Mcdonalds stopped sales. If you can light a fire and you know that a piece of meat needs to be cooked over a heat source then you will be ok. If the economy collapses and the ability to exchange money ends then the pharmaceutical companies will stop producing drugs. the factory farms will shut down. Going back to living like our parents did in the 30's would be something we will manage. I'm a huge fan of knowing where your food comes from and making stuff from raw ingredients so I know there are no additives in it. If my kids want cake then my wife does some baking. If they want a savoury dish I get cooking. I don't bake as I can't stand using scales. I make bread and fresh pasta and we grow our own herbs. We end up with more tomatoes than we can eat and in late summer it takes ages to get the kids home from school as they forage for blackberries all the way back. Now I know that I'm a rank amateur compared to most of you guys as I don't hunt and apart from foraging for fresh water mussels in the Thames I haven't fished for years but with the knowledge you guys show on this forum you will be able to weather the storm for the months that it takes to blow over if the wheel does fall off. Stay in touch with nature, that's the key. I was looking at buying a flat to rent out recently and the estate weasel said that you don't even need kitchens in them any more as no one cooks. Most trendy young execs want a fridge, kettle and a microwave. Apart from that they will eat out all the time or get take away delivered. Make Hugh F-W prime minister and Ray Mears minister for the economy and we should all be ok.

[happybonzo]

If the economy collapses and the ability to exchange money ends then the pharmaceutical companies will stop producing drugs.

You may be right but if so, I would be dead within 2 weeks :)

[Silverback]

Like you Dan, my wife and I can grow, and cook what we grow. We can use a firearm,and butcher what we shoot. We know how to fish, and cook what we catch. My missus is a nurse, and I'm a medic and we have medical supplies - we should do ok.

[Dan XF]

Down here where I live I'd be surrounded by execs wandering around aimlessly wondering where the au pair went and why the country club has stopped taking their Amex card and how the wife is going to get hold of that lovely Italian Rocket to go with the wild Alaskan Salmon at Hugo's party or how on earth they are going to pay the livery fees for Jacincta's pony. I guess I'll be eating tomatoes and basil from the garden and teaching the kids how to poach fish from the Loddon.

[Silverback]

Up here we are not short of flora and fauna I could borrow ;-). I'm rather partial to grouse and pheasant. Not far to travel to get deer either or mountain hare for that matter. We have some lovely trout becks and fully stocked rivers a short hike away.

Not bad given we were once surrounded by heavy industry - most of the industry has gone though, so has most of the pollution ...along with the jobs

[happybonzo]

Down here where I live I'd be surrounded by execs wandering around aimlessly wondering where the au pair went and why the country club has stopped taking their Amex card and how the wife is going to get hold of that lovely Italian Rocket to go with the wild Alaskan Salmon at Hugo's party or how on earth they are going to pay the livery fees for Jacincta's pony. I guess I'll be eating tomatoes and basil from the garden and teaching the kids how to poach fish from the Loddon.

Many a true word said in jest

[rossbird]

Given this is the season to be jolly !!!
I am confident we will come through this intact. I'd like to say wiser, sadly that doesn't appear to work, each recession we are promised more safeguards, no more boom and bust. Then the next government comes to power and the cycle repeats itself.
I understand that outside influences play a part, but when house prices are out of control, personal debt is at a all time high, you just know there will be trouble.
Don't think many could have foreseen how deep this one would be.

[bigzee]

I think most people nowadays would struggle if Dominos or Mcdonalds stopped sales. If you can light a fire and you know that a piece of meat needs to be cooked over a heat source then you will be ok. If the economy collapses and the ability to exchange money ends then the pharmaceutical companies will stop producing drugs. the factory farms will shut down. Going back to living like our parents did in the 30's would be something we will manage. I'm a huge fan of knowing where your food comes from and making stuff from raw ingredients so I know there are no additives in it. If my kids want cake then my wife does some baking. If they want a savoury dish I get cooking. I don't bake as I can't stand using scales. I make bread and fresh pasta and we grow our own herbs. We end up with more tomatoes than we can eat and in late summer it takes ages to get the kids home from school as they forage for blackberries all the way back. Now I know that I'm a rank amateur compared to most of you guys as I don't hunt and apart from foraging for fresh water mussels in the Thames I haven't fished for years but with the knowledge you guys show on this forum you will be able to weather the storm for the months that it takes to blow over if the wheel does fall off. Stay in touch with nature, that's the key. I was looking at buying a flat to rent out recently and the estate weasel said that you don't even need kitchens in them any more as no one cooks. Most trendy young execs want a fridge, kettle and a microwave. Apart from that they will eat out all the time or get take away delivered. Make Hugh F-W prime minister and Ray Mears minister for the economy and we should all be ok.
I agree with everything you say here, except the use of weasel in a derisory sense. The weasel is my favourite british animal as anyone who has seen one in action cannot fail but be impressed.

[happybonzo]

Don't think many could have foreseen how deep this one would be.

I think they may have done: When Tony Blair was asked about the economy during his Premiership he replied that he knew that they, the Labour Government, had been extremely lucky


Please note - this is not to start a political debate.

[Silverback]

Please note - this is not to start a political debate.

Good call!

[rossbird]

I think they may have done: When Tony Blair was asked about the economy during his Premiership he replied that he knew that they, the Labour Government, had been extremely lucky


Please note - this is not to start a political debate.

I always thought Blair was referring to the fact that the world economy had prospered throughout his time in office, I may be wrong!
However I stand by my original post on this. There was always going to be a redress at some point, some economists had warned of the levels of debt worldwide. I don't remember any of them warning of a recession of this magnitude.

[swkieran]

it was going to happen soona or later (going bust),to much greed in the world etc,you have 1 half starving and the other half with a massive obesity problem,no money for one half ,while the other half live in a fantasy rich man's world,new cars,loans,credit cards galore,holiday's 3 times a year,property ownership,all why we were earning a pittance on national minuim wage or slightly above lol,we will come through this slow down,so nobody panic,,also have you noticed how much nicer people are since all this economic crises:),theres a comming together which i think is fantastic,worth more than any stupid credit card lol

[happybonzo]

I don't remember any of them warning of a recession of this magnitude.

Mike Shadlock has been banging on about it for years