A little advice would be greatly appreciated. (Long trek)

[Luke]

I'm thinking of going for a long trek. A long long trek. At some point. Once I'm confident enough.

The only problem is, I have no experience and next to no gear. But that is not so important or a permanent problem. I'll take it step by step till I can achieve my goal.



Would anyone be kind enough to give me a rundown on the gear you would use on such a trek and for general bushcraft and wilderness survival.

My Checklist: (This is now a checklist for things I am going to buy, feel free to scrutinise or suggest)

Shelter
Hammock - DD Travel
Tarp - ??

Cooking
Pots - any old.
Stove - Trangia Triangle style DIY. Or.. just the fire pit.

General Purpose
Fallkniven DC4 - pocket whetstone.
Compass - ??
Map - Depends on location.

Tools
Fire - Firesteel.
The work knife - ??
The delicate knife - ??
The multitool - Leatherman of some sort.
The axe - ??

Health and safety
FAK - I'll put one together.



Tips and advice are greatly appreciated.

[dannyreid1978]

I'll be honest with you straight from the off you are heading into danger, don't take this the wrong way I don't mean it to sound bad you will get yourself into trouble especially if you know as little as you say you know. It is a awesome idea and would be brilliant for someone to survive that way but unfortunately chances are you'll get lost or get caught out in a storm and be in bother soon. I'd keep it as a goal absolutely but start off with something doable first.

Danny

[Bernie]

Like Danny suggested, I'd keep that goal in mind and start with baby steps. If you can't read a map and navigate by compass, you'll need to get training if you're headed for a large area of little population like Dartmoor.

It'd help if people knew your budget. Many things can be made for a fraction of the cost of buying them. On the other hand, if you want ultra light kit, it can cost a small fortune. I'll let our resident poshcrafters (headed up by the ultimate poshcrafter, Martin) advise on those things.

My kit for walking and camping would probably be:
Camp
* Tarp and ground sheet
* Four season sleeping bag

Cooking
* Hobo stove / pop-can meths stove
* Fuel for stove and means to light it
* Billy can set for cooking in
* Cutlery set, plate and mug

Navigation
* OS Maps
* Compass
* Torch
* GPS?

Essentials
* First aid kit and some medicine (painkillers at least)
* Small spade/trowl for toilet digging
* Toilet paper
* Toiletries bag
* Water purification tablets? (not sure where you're going)
* Hat, poncho
* Couple of sets of clothes, or at least fresh jocks and socks

Entertainment
* Carving knife and associated items (sandpaper)
* Folding saw

And of course, a backpack big enough for all that and your spare clothes.

No doubt I've forgotten a few things, but it's a start.

Start small, baby steps will give you the confidence or make you realise that it's maybe not what you want after all, before you find yourself alone in the wilderness and in trouble.

Good luck to you, you are more adventurous than me.

[Silverback]

I'll be honest with you straight from the off you are heading into danger, don't take this the wrong way I don't mean it to sound bad you will get yourself into trouble especially if you know as little as you say you know. It is a awesome idea and would be brilliant for someone to survive that way but unfortunately chances are you'll get lost or get caught out in a storm and be in bother soon. I'd keep it as a goal absolutely but start off with something doable first.

Danny

Good advice - please take it.

[Luke]

Is there any real beneficial difference between Hammock and tent?

As far as I can see: Hammock is slightly lighter, but not so much to make it a breaking point.
Hammock is up and off the ground keeping you away from dampness or critters etc.
But tent seemingly is much more draught proof and rugged. I think I'd rather be in a tent than a hammock in torrential ran and wind.

What size rucksack would you guys go with for a long trek? And what weight are we talking?

p.s
don't worry Sapper, danny. I just needed to get the thoughts written down. I've got a lot of thinking to do.

[Silverback]

don't worry Sapper, danny. I just needed to get the thoughts written down. I've got a lot of thinking to do.

I do worry though...... sometimes get to deal with the aftermath of poorly planned trips. For example the 3 people who set off to walk a famous long distance path with a tent and a tarp, a tin of sardines and one water bottle between them. Navigating by AA road map over some of the bleakest bog in the UK. They separated leaving one to continue......3 mountain rescue teams and 5 search and rescue dogs later he was found...luckily it was July....Theres more stories like this one, pull up a sandbag...... Prior Preparation and Planning Prevents Pretty Poor Performance.

[TheOutdoorist]

What you plan is do able, but not at your current stage in my opinion.

I would not put your planned trip aside, just learn more first in preparation.
Find out what shelter works for you, i like a tarp and hammock or bivy bag with sleeping bag. Then spend a night or two out using the kit.
Practice your fire lighting with different materials in different weather conditions.
Practice some outdoor cooking whether its on a stove or over a fire. Also boiling water will purify it after it has been filtered as long as there are no chemical pollutants. I recommend a milbank bag for filtration.

When you are confident you have the knowledge and kit to do your trip, use the kit and stay a few night in local woodlands you know well. Most of all enjoy the experience.

If I was planning to do what you plan to do here is the kit I would aim to take:
Rucksack
Tarp (Alpkit Rig 7)
Sleeping bag
Sleeping mat (currently multimat- upgrade planned)
Bivy bag or Hammock (Alpkit Hunka XL or Tenth Wonder hammock)
Cookpot (MSR Titan Kettle)
500ml clip lock tub and pot cosy
Titanium spork
Titanium Evernew stove and trivet
Meths
Platypus water bottles
Food/Tea/Coffee
Windscreen
Lighter
Firesteel and tinder
Whistle
First aid kit
Torch/Headtorch *spare batteries
Small knife/neck knife
Hygiene kit
Map and compass

Clothing is essential and should be looked into well and used before the trip.

I would consider adding my UCO mini candle lantern

When walking long distances over time weight is crucial. Try to keep kit as light and compact as possible. Kit is an investment and can be found cheaply but try out all your kit as you do not want it failing when it is needed. It is a lot easier to find out your stove is damaged or similar in the back garden where it can be easily resolved.

When going out be sure to let people know where you are going and when you will be back. Enjoy the experience and pack a camera! :)

Please feel free to Private Message me, I am no expert but will help however possible

[happybonzo]

Without wishing to appear flippant, read this Forum for a year and you'll have a better idea what you should be doing.

[f0rm4t]

You can do what ever you want, just take it in small steps.
Get the gear. Slowly acquire the knowledge. But most important, *get out there*. Don't be an arm chair outdoorist or YouTube bushcrafter.

Slow & safe. Know your limits and push them in safe steps.

I'm planning long trips this year, the main goal being to walk the length of the North Downs which is very near to where I live.

I, like you, knew very little this time last year, but getting out there, getting the knowledge, getting the kit, *USING* the kit, and learning in fantastic communities like this give you knowledge needed to take on the larger goals.

Don't take the physical requirement for granted!
Go out and try a 10-15 mile hike on a well used trail for the day. You'll know where I'm coming from, the day after.
a 2 dayer
a 3 dayer
etc etc

Small, manageable steps! :)

Don't be a name on Sappers SAR forms! ;)

[Silverback]

Don't be a name on Sappers SAR forms! ;)

Or worse...the subject of an inquest

[Luke]

Sapper, I appreciate the concern. I'll take it in steps.

Thanks for the tips everyone.
Can anyone recommend a good all-round knife? Not a pocket knife, a fixed blade.

I'm still not really sure on whether to buy a good hammock or a good tent.. It seems to me a tent would be more the ideal choice for long journeys and such? As you're inevitably going to encounter some nasty weather.

[f0rm4t]

Can anyone recommend a good all-round knife? Not a pocket knife, a fixed blade.

Need a budget really.
Like everything in this world, you can spend a little or a lot. £10 to £200+

IMHO the Mora's are the best beginner knife. £10
http://www.greenmanbushcraft.co.uk/cutting-tools/knives/frosts-mora-bushcraft-training-knife-high-carbon-clipper.htm

My personal choice. £190 (no I don't own on)
http://www.thebushcraftstore.co.uk/the-timberwolf-bushcraft-knife---olive-wood-10155-p.asp

[Bob W]

I can recommend the Vango banshee 200, the new model, unlike my older model :( can be pitched fly sheet first, a real bonus if it's wet. Mine's quick and easy to erect, the newer model should be even quicker. Not the lightest but also not a heavyweight by any means.

[TheOutdoorist]

Can anyone recommend a good all-round knife? Not a pocket knife, a fixed blade.

Mora's are highly recommended, especially when starting off as they are a great blade and the price is excellent. At one stage I had over 100 blades but now I have 3 fixed blade knives all are handmade but that is just a personal preference. I also like Bark River Knives, Spyderco and Fallkniven make a good blade too.


I'm still not really sure on whether to buy a good hammock or a good tent.. It seems to me a tent would be more the ideal choice for long journeys and such? As you're inevitably going to encounter some nasty weather.

With a hammock you will need a tarp. A tarp will keep you dry as long as you guy it out properly. You most likely will encounter bad weather but the hammock will keep you up off the floor so you are dry, the tarp will cover you, you wake up to a great view and have no condensation worries. I choose to use a tarp/hammock setup for the weight and packing size of them combined.

[Luke]

Need a budget really.
Hmmm.. nothing too expensive. Mid range stuff - So there's still a good bit of trust I can put in it.

TheOutdoorist, you think the hammock is safer than tent then? What if you're stuck in gale-force winds? It'd rip that tarp right up and out from between the trees wouldn't it? Or are these tarps made to endure that sort of beating? Then again I think the tent would get a good beating in such weather as well. Having a tent collapse and possibly drag you about is also not fun.

Hmm

Ok I'm going to get a Mora. They're dirt cheap anyways and if they're as good as everyone is saying then why not. I'm also getting an Opinel 8 folding knife.

[OakAshandThorn]

You can do what ever you want, just take it in small steps.
Get the gear. Slowly acquire the knowledge. But most important, *get out there*. Don't be an arm chair outdoorist or YouTube bushcrafter.

Slow & safe. Know your limits and push them in safe steps.

I'm planning long trips this year, the main goal being to walk the length of the North Downs which is very near to where I live.

I, like you, knew very little this time last year, but getting out there, getting the knowledge, getting the kit, *USING* the kit, and learning in fantastic communities like this give you knowledge needed to take on the larger goals.

Don't take the physical requirement for granted!
Go out and try a 10-15 mile hike on a well used trail for the day. You'll know where I'm coming from, the day after.
a 2 dayer
a 3 dayer
etc etc

Small, manageable steps! :)

Don't be a name on Sappers SAR forms! ;)
T^ Very well said ;).

[luresalive]

It's simple, if you have to ask for basic advice for such a trip then you are obviously not ready to undertake it..please study,practice and research more, go out for a few days at a time, then a week (at different times of the year and in different environments) and if you can manage all that then and only then start planning your adventure.

[Luke]

Thanks for the concern. Like I said, I'll take it step by step.

Still interested in peoples views on gear choices for long journey bushcraftery.

Hammock or tent?
35L or 60L backpack??

I'll get rid of that first part of my post and make a kit checklist. I need to get the kit anyways for bushcrafting and wilderness survival to practice!

[rawfish111]

I'll be honest with you straight from the off you are heading into danger, don't take this the wrong way I don't mean it to sound bad you will get yourself into trouble especially if you know as little as you say you know. It is a awesome idea and would be brilliant for someone to survive that way but unfortunately chances are you'll get lost or get caught out in a storm and be in bother soon. I'd keep it as a goal absolutely but start off with something doable first.

Danny

Spot on!

[rawfish111]

Hmmm.. nothing too expensive. Mid range stuff - So there's still a good bit of trust I can put in it.

TheOutdoorist, you think the hammock is safer than tent then? What if you're stuck in gale-force winds? It'd rip that tarp right up and out from between the trees wouldn't it? Or are these tarps made to endure that sort of beating? Then again I think the tent would get a good beating in such weather as well. Having a tent collapse and possibly drag you about is also not fun.

Hmm

Ok I'm going to get a Mora. They're dirt cheap anyways and if they're as good as everyone is saying then why not. I'm also getting an Opinel 8 folding knife.

On a camp bed and in a bivi bag (army issue so nothing uber posh) I slept through a salto thunderstorm perfectly dry and comfy so I would say to make sure whatever kit you pick ... use it correctly.

Opinel are good knives and keep a very nice edge. I always carry one for a spare and also one in work.

As has been said; work up, take it in steps, be safe.

[Luke]

Wow, that's pretty impressive! Did you wake up in the same place right? haha only kidding.

It's boiling down to hammock. I'm still on the edge though. I'm not bothered about comfortability that much. Practicality is my main focus.

My only problems with hammock are:
Biggest problem is.. It's very exposed to the elements.. Whereas in a tent you're nice and closed off.
In the off chance that you can't find any trees for whatever reason.. well you're a little screwed to say the least.

How does the hammock and tarp fair in rainy and windy conditions? Even storm conditions.

[f0rm4t]

DD Travel hammock can be used on the ground too mate.

Use your trekking poles (Which I'd recommend getting for long walks) I have LEKI Thermolite, and are my personal choice.

(not my pic)
http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/6559/mysetup4.jpg

[Luke]

That's pretty nifty! Might just be the tipping point!

Is that the DD tarp?

Edit:
Alright I've decided on the DD travel.



EDIT:
Is there any point in using a Snugpak S15 sleeping bag if I'm going to be using a Hammock + Tarp + cocoon??

That seems like total overkill. There was a fault with my Snugpak s15 so I've got to contact them about a replacement. I might ask and see if they would be willing to send me a cheaper sleeping bag, and their Jungle hammock with it. Saves money that way.

[sblog]

The sleeping bag you choose will depend in what time of year your thinking of going....and will have a bearing on what size rucksack you take. The colder the weather, the bigger the bag (especially with man made) the bigger the rucksack you're gonna need to carry it.

Snugpak are good bags, I've got the Elite 5, which is rated down to -20, although I don't think I want to test it :D

Don't use the compression sack for your rucksack. To pack it away - hold the foot end and spin it around. Once the air is out of it, stuff it into you rucksack feet first. Having it in the compression sack makes it a solid block and takes up more space. If you ditch the sack, you can stuff kit in and around it your sleeping bag in your rucksack.

Also, get a bivvy bag it keep you dry and provide additional insulation - army surplus Gore-Tex off fleabay......and kKeep you sleeping bag inside the bivy when packing it away - sames time and effort.....

As everyone says, take small steps and build yorself up to you goal - Rome wasn't built in a day!!

[TheOutdoorist]

Is that the DD tarp?

That is the DD tarp.

I always use a tarp and then swap between hammock and bivy bag. I've only got wet once with my tarp due to poor pitching but after feeling a little rain i altered it and was dry all night, and that was very bad weather. Pack was wet when i realized it was covered bt the tarp but on a ground sheet that was not fully covered and the water pooled under my pack :(

[VEV]

For what its worth, I think the step by step approach is the best way to learn about not only the practical sides of wilderness camping but also to learn about your own limitations. I made the decision this year to aim for some wilderness solo camping but its a big deal and I have decided to practice what I can at home, lighting fires feathering, flint and steel practice, kit needs etc and I am going to go to local campsites who allow campfires and test out my kit ( especially sleeping kit, warmth etc) and then do day treks from the campsites. Only when I feel confident that I know my kit and have enough knowledge (but knowledge building is infinite) will I even consider venturing further afield. I am also walking 7 to 8 miles per day at weekends building up on my carry weight. ATM carrying 15 lb but building up to 26 lb as thats what I am aiming to carry for a lightweight 2-3 day spring summer trek. Also I am spending many hours learning useful info and tips from the members here. BTW I am a middle aged woman which also adds a few extra factors to the safety issues of solo camping but common sense has a part to play here too. Cheers

[nilo52]

"Luke.... use the FORCE Luke"
In this case , the "FORCE" is all the good information and help you can acquire here. I think what you propose is a do -able adventure ! However , it all shits and giggles until someone giggles and shits !
I think doing it in stages as suggested is key here. Also start when the season is good, ie SUMMER ! Your chance of success will be much better for sure ! There are a lot of proposed meets listed here , why not attend one and get yourself "sorted" as you guys say ? I bet you would have a great time !

[nilo52]

VEV ,
YOUR NOT MIDDLE AGED ! Your young with some EXPERIENCE :happy-clapping:
NILO

[VEV]

Thanks nilo for your uplifting comment.! Thanks to you have decided i wont use that depressing stupid term again and will take on yours instead as thats what i FEEL... young! Yeah!

[simonc]

Hey Vev, not met you before, its great to see people who are maturing in years doing what you are doing. You're not alone I myself am just coming up to 27 for the second time ( for those with not enough fingers I am 54). What I say to people is "Thats not grey hair, I've had a silver rinse" Heh Heh!!"
I am actually planning some trips myself but like everyone is saying it will be in steps, as I'm not sure of my fitness level. My trips will be in less wild places than Dartmor, Lake District or Scotland for instance, I live in Kent but I am still testing both my fitness and capabilities before the longer trips it is the most sensible way to go about things weather you are young and fit or not so young and fit.
Best of luck with your plans LUKE but do listen to what people are saying, but I'm sure you will be sensble enough to do so, as you are asking a lot of questions first, just take heed and enjoy yourself Atb my friend. Simon