Cellphones in Bushcrafting

[Corbeau]

So 'cause the discussion got out of hand in my other thread, I'm going to start a new one on usability, relaiance and so on and so forth here.

Discuss your minds out.

A point that caught my attention was:


An aside: I was browsing the 2011 MREW stats (http://www.mountain.rescue.org.uk/assets/files/resources/2011AnnualReport2ndEditionpdf.pdf) and couldn't help seeing this on page 10: "Row 8 - the number of incidents initiated using a mobile phone by the subject requiring assistance." the statistic is 49% - much higher than I expected.

That'S the mainreason for this thread. If my english doesn't betray me, that states that the people in need of rescue where able to call for it by cellphone, right?

Happy discussing,
Corbeau

[Silverback]

That 49% is only 'activation' it may not actually be from the site of the incident. Some of the busiest teams in the country have the best phone reception at some of their accident hotspots...others may not.....

http://www.mountain.rescue.org.uk/information-centre/incident-statistics

and this is the advice

."..and the right equipment

A map and compass are essential kit and should be easily accessible – not buried in the rucksack!
A mobile phone and GPS are useful tools but don't rely on your mobile to get you out of trouble – in may areas of the mountains there is no signal coverage.
Take a whistle and learn the signal for rescue. Six good long blasts. Stop for one minute. Repeat. Carry on the whistle blasts until someone reaches you and don't stop because you've heard a reply – rescuers may be using your blasts as a direction finder.
A torch (plus spare batteries and bulbs) is a must. Use it for signalling in the same pattern as for whistle blasts.
At least one reliable watch in the party.
Cllimbers and mountain bikers should wear a helmet. In winter conditions, an ice-axe, crampons and survival bag are essential.
Emergency survival kit comprising spare clothing and a bivvi bag."

[Big Stu 12]

Relienace on a Mobile phone..... dont.......

[Aragorn]

Ive got to agree, id never go on the hills without a mobile, but chances are when I needed it would be the time with no signal. Much better to make sure someone will miss you if you dont return by a set time, and leave them details of the route you would be taking.

[Kit Mac]

As stated a mobile should only be one tool in your safety precautions. But this video is worth a watch to make it a little more effective in some circumstances.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XPZv_8dABfU

[Kernowek Scouser]

Out of curiosity, how many members have an I.C.E. number in the contact on their mobile?

[rawfish111]

Out of curiosity, how many members have an I.C.E. number in the contact on their mobile?

Yup and the buggers can use it if 1) it survives the fall and 2) if they can figure out my password! Also 3) they may just have to pay the bill so that it will cooperate! :jumping-joy:

All tongue in cheek of course before anyone gets out of their pram I normally leave a route plan and contacts card on view in the motor and carry one in my top pocket. Poxy mobile phone (if it has a signal) carried but off in case the wife wants a satellite nag. Not tongue in cheek.

[FishyFolk]

I am pretty sure that 99% of all bushcraft happens within spitting distance from the nearest pub. Most Bushcrafters are not mounting expeditions into the deep unknown, and will be able to call mum for help from wherever they are in 95% of the cases. The last 5 % covering malfunctions, dead batteries, lost phones, and no coverage. And that 99% of all calls or use of the said phones is the bushcraftyer calling their mom/wife to tell them that they will come homne a tad later than planned because they overslept in their hammocks... :sad:

[Old Guard]

they will come homne a tad later than planned because they overslept in their hammocks... :sad:

T^ :)

[Corbeau]

yeah but if the other 1% is saving a live it is fine, at least thats what i think.

I don'T have a ICE number on my phone because it is locked ... i have emergency contacts in my wallet, my jacket inside pocket and in the toppocket of my backpack...that should be enough.

[snowleopard]

I am pretty sure that 99% of all bushcraft happens within spitting distance from the nearest pub. Most Bushcrafters are not mounting expeditions into the deep unknown, and will be able to call mum for help from wherever they are in 95% of the cases. The last 5 % covering malfunctions, dead batteries, lost phones, and no coverage. And that 99% of all calls or use of the said phones is the bushcraftyer calling their mom/wife to tell them that they will come homne a tad later than planned because they overslept in their hammocks... :sad:

:jumping-joy:

[Silverback]

a word to the wise.......

http://www.grough.co.uk/magazine/2013/06/21/mobile-phone-warning-after-lost-glencoe-pair-airlifted-from-2000ft

[Ehecatl]

“He too was recovered to the helicopter once he had calmed down enough for the strop to be fitted over his head and under his arms.”

Sounds to me like Lt Cdr Drodge is being very diplomatic!

[fish]

i carry one for emergencys,sim card and battery out and in baggies so i cant be tracked or listened to by GCHQ.

[Silverback]

sounds to me like lt cdr drodge is being very diplomatic!

lol

[Silverback]

"A rescue team pleaded with walkers to carry a map and compass after they were called out to find two lost walkers on the highest hill in the Pennines."

http://www.grough.co.uk/magazine/2013/06/25/two-lost-walkers-found-sheltering-after-cross-fell-search

And

"Two mountain rescue teams were called out to search for a pair of mountain bikers lost on a Peak District hill.
The bikers called for help in the early hours of Saturday after getting lost in the dark on Bleaklow."

http://www.grough.co.uk/magazine/2013/06/25/two-bleaklow-mountain-bikers-rescue-after-getting-lost-in-dark

In both cases the people called for help on mobile phones.....

[Corbeau]

hmmm, which in my opinion means that the cell was usefull, don't get me wrong those people shouldn't have lost their way in the first place, aka basic navigation skills and equippment are a must, but in the end a situation for all of them got solved because they could call for help ... else it maybe wouldn't have been a rescue mission but a bodybag mission...

[ADz]

hmmm, which in my opinion means that the cell was usefull, don't get me wrong those people shouldn't have lost their way in the first place, aka basic navigation skills and equippment are a must, but in the end a shitsituation for all of them got solved because they could call for help ... else it maybe wouldn't have been a rescue mission but a bodybag mission...


T^

[Silverback]

maybe wouldn't have been a rescue mission but a bodybag mission...

Or just a chilly, uncomfortable, but survivable night on the moor........which would have been the case for both examples.

There are other ways to 'call for help' six whistle blasts or flashes of a torch, or the sending up of red flares.

"A rescue team pleaded with walkers to carry a map and compass after they were called out to find two lost walkers on the highest hill in the Pennines." - This is quite an important statement and should not be overlooked. The people actually doing the rescues are asking this...

In the opinion of MREW, MRCoS and most other rescue/SAR agencies in the UK the mobile phone is not to be relied upon and should not be used willy nilly. I would be very remiss as a member if I did not promote the standing message of these organisations. At a national and team level in the UK there is and has been for a long time a request to carry the most basic of things. The addition of very basic equipment and very basic skills can make all the difference.

[Silverback]

http://www.grough.co.uk/magazine/2013/06/21/mobile-phone-warning-after-lost-glencoe-pair-airlifted-from-2000ft

http://www.grough.co.uk/magazine/2011/10/14/plea-for-walkers-to-pack-a-torch-after-night-time-rescue

http://www.grough.co.uk/magazine/2013/04/18/learn-to-navigate-call-after-rescue-of-pair-who-climbed-mountain-by-mistake

http://www.grough.co.uk/magazine/2013/05/15/rescuers-plea-take-map-and-compass-and-learn-to-navigate

Now then the net result of this thread is that I'm not going to waver from promoting the national message from the SAR organisations I'm allied to and a member of and you wont waver from your view that mobile phones are great - so lets save each other more keyboard time and agree to disagree....

[BJ]

I can add nothing to the expert advice already posted here but would like to add my thoughts.
I always have my mobile with me but considering I need to leave it on the windowsill at home to try to get the intermittent signal, it is the last thing I would rely on. I have a Garmin that also loses the satellites in a valley or under a good canopy of trees. These things are great when they work and good fun but seriously a map and compass and the ability to use them in conjunction with the safety kit already mentioned is in my humble opinion a minimum requirement for anybody going off the beaten track. http://yoursmiles.org/tsmile/subject/t57025.gif (http://yoursmiles.org/t-subject.php?page=2)
Most people take the sensible precaution to have a map, spare wheel, spare lamps etc when driving and this is on our crowded roads. It never ceases to amaze me that the same people will then wander off into an area they don't know with no kit at all because it's leisure and therefore fun and "what could possibly go wrong". http://yoursmiles.org/tsmile/fear/t3612.gif (http://yoursmiles.org/t-fear.php)

[Silverback]

Most people take the sensible precaution to have a map, spare wheel, spare lamps etc when driving and this is on our crowded roads.

and of course on the continent its a legal requirement !!

[Silverback]

http://www.buzzfeed.com/daves4/pictures-that-prove-society-is-doomed

the persecution rests ;)

[Silverback]

http://www.grough.co.uk/magazine/2013/07/06/lost-scafell-pike-walkers-999-call-avoidable

“The lost couple of walkers had no mountaineering experience, no map or compass, limited equipment and clothing. They also did not know where they had started from or where they were going to."........!!

[FishyFolk]

http://www.grough.co.uk/magazine/2013/07/06/lost-scafell-pike-walkers-999-call-avoidable

“The lost couple of walkers had no mountaineering experience, no map or compass, limited equipment and clothing. They also did not know where they had started from or where they were going to."........!!

Good thing they had a mobile phone with them then so that “The team leader quickly established their location as Mickledore, which is a col between Scafell and Scafell Pike and managed to talk them from the col down the gully into Wasdale without needing to mobilise the team."

[Silverback]

you miss the point Rune....They had zero experience, and were part of an organised charity challenge which was so badly supervised they ended up left behind and lost on the mountain.

If they had been correctly led, or able to navigate themselves then a phone call to anyone would have been totally avoided.....

Its far too easy to pick up the phone these days calling out essential emergency services to what are effectively false alarms where basic skills could prevent the call ever occuring..leaving the rescue teams to deal with people in real need of life saving assistance

[FishyFolk]

you miss the point Rune....They had zero experience, and were part of an organised charity challenge which was so badly supervised they ended up left behind and lost on the mountain.

If they had been correctly led, or able to navigate themselves then a phone call to anyone would have been totally avoided.....

Its far too easy to pick up the phone these days calling out essential emergency services to what are effectively false alarms where basic skills could prevent the call ever occuring..leaving the rescue teams to deal with people in real need of life saving assistance

I see your point, and agree. Yet rescue services in Norway is embracing mobile phone technology, and their GPS location apps have allready saved lives. They work by sending your position
and some other info as an SMS to rescue services. But just like a map and compass you need to learn how and when to use it. And you can not assume that people will seek out this info on their own.
It's one of those things that need to be thought by society as a whole, i.e in schools. In Norwegian schools basic orienteering or wahtever itæs called is part of the yearly curricilum. Knowing when and how to use your mobile device to call for help should also be part of that.

We do have our fair share of morons here too. Before the mobile phone, Darwins law would take care of these individuals, now that the mobile phone and all that technology is here, "we" need to learn how to use it.

That I am a firm beliver in the map and compass, but I equally believe that leaving your mobile phone at home is as idiotic as leaving your map and compass. Unless you go into an area with no coverage at all...but even then...even with no signal showing, you could get an SMS out.

[ADz]

That I am a firm beliver in the map and compass, but I equally believe that leaving your mobile phone at home is as idiotic as leaving your map and compass. Unless you go into an area with no coverage at all...but even then...even with no signal showing, you could get an SMS out.

My thoughts exactly.

Plus even with no signal/data coverage you can still get GPS and if you have a offline map you also have navigation.

I'm planning on doing a decent navigation's course at some point but will still also have/use more modern tech if needed/wanted then I at least have both sets of skills to use/fall back on.

[Silverback]

Never said to leave the mobile at home......I sell the National Organisations message of not relying on it and not calling because youre late for lunch or a dinner party, or to check the bus times (these are true)....We have our own SAR app here designed for SAR by SAR (doesnt work on blackberry though)...We dont educate our folks at school, or via public information messages here, and theres a noticable hurrumph of righteous idignation from some avenues when anyone suggests that they may want to take a little bit more responsibility for their own well being.

In a nation populated by nearly 60 million folks the UK has only circa 3500 MR volunteers......and less than 100 search and rescue dogs across the whole of the 4 nations so the resources are spread very thinly and with operational costs paid for solely by public donation. These calls are taking resources away from more needy injured folks .....(Lowland SAR not included in these figures because they dont get called to mountainous/moorland or upland jobs)

[FishyFolk]

Never said to leave the mobile at home......I sell the National Organisations message of not relying on it and not calling because youre late for lunch or a dinner party, or to check the bus times (these are true)....We have our own SAR app here designed for SAR by SAR (doesnt work on blackberry though)...We dont educate our folks at school, or via public information messages here, and theres a noticable hurrumph of righteous idignation from some avenues when anyone suggests that they may want to take a little bit more responsibility for their own well being.

In a nation populated by nearly 60 million folks the UK has only circa 3500 MR volunteers......and less than 100 search and rescue dogs across the whole of the 4 nations so the resources are spread very thinly and with operational costs paid for solely by public donation. These calls are taking resources away from more needy injured folks .....(Lowland SAR not included in these figures because they dont get called to mountainous/moorland or upland jobs)

Our SAR system is organized much the same way as yours. Only the SAR helicopters are military. Al of the rest are volunteers and paid for mostly by donations and little old grannies knitrting lottery prizes. And we have the same idiots you have. We just don't have as many per square kilometer as you.

Yet I I suffer a heart failure in the hills, I will have to wait 30-45 minutes for a medevac chopper to reach me, if it can come at all. There is f.ex only 12 SAR helicopters in Norway. The closest ones are based in Bodø (aging Sea Kings, falling appart) , 320 km south of me. There is an air ambulance helicopter based in Tromsø, 300 km north of me, but that one need to be able to land to get to me. They don't have a lift capabillity as far as I know.

Anyway, what you are complaining about is not the technology, but the way people use it it. And if nobody is teaching, how do you expect them to learn?
But okay things where really bad here in Norway too, until one easter when dozens of people lost their lives in the hills, during a single easter. Since then national TV has been runnng campaigns
every year drving in the message: learn the map and compass, abide by the Mountain code, etc...combined with education in schools and other places.

But we still lose the odd idiot...in later years, mostly foreign tourists though...

[FishyFolk]

Had to look it up...the largest volunteer SAR organisation here is The Norwegian Red Cross Rescue Corps (NRCRC), they are organized in 300 districts, have 13000 members and can mobilize 6500 trained people for search and rescue. And thats only one organisation.

[Silverback]

Had to look it up...the largest volunteer SAR organisation here is The Norwegian Red Cross Rescue Corps (NRCRC), they are organized in 300 districts, have 13000 members and can mobilize 6500 trained people for search and rescue. And thats only one organisation.

Exactly...Im talking the ENTIRE MR organiasation of the UK is only 3500 ish

[Silverback]

.

Anyway, what you are complaining about is not the technology, but the way people use it it..

When we didnt have the technology they learned the skills.......or stayed at home


Anyway back on topic.......mobile phones are ok for emergencies ie, life and death situations, injury or sickness and should not be a replacement for learning good solid skills which may not only avoid an uncomfortable night on a mountain/moor but may save your life long before you get an intermittent mobile signal

[FishyFolk]

When we didnt have the technology they learned the skills.......or stayed at home


Anyway back on topic.......mobile phones are ok for emergencies ie, life and death situations, injury or sickness and should not be a replacement for learning good solid skills which may not only avoid an uncomfortable night on a mountain/moor but may save your life long before you get an intermittent mobile signal

I agree, but you can't turn back time. The technology is here to stay. And the trouble is that people have the technology, but are not learning how to use it.

Having a GPS on the phone is nice. But how many have actually downloaded a terrain map on it that is not depending on a data conncection to work?
Google maps are fine to navigate the car trough the streets and roadsystem, but off-road it's useless. But most people are ignorant of that, unless thay take a special interest in that sort of thing.

Here on the coast of Norway we are kind of spoiled. As we do have excellent mobile coverage almost everywhere. From mountain to far out at sea...

[Silverback]

Before we got our own stand alone system I used to look at Google earth aerial imaging to look at search areas alongside OS mapping...great search tool....useless as a navigational aid.

As I said to Corbeau though Rune...I'm always going to fall down on the SAR side of the fence and promote the national message.....all the while hoping the government will invest in a programme of information dissemination (HAH!) In the meantime the happy band of SAR volunteers will continue to do their best to promote safety on hill, dale and at sea by whatever means we have, be that leaflets, talks, facebook or even twitter

[Corbeau]

Sorry, I din't contribute the last 2 weeks as a I was on a holiday back home and just dind't have the time to look at the internet.


When we didnt have the technology they learned the skills.......or stayed at home

Hmm, at least in Germany, that's not really true. The only thing I can compare, is my own memory of news and I think people are still as unprepared, unskilled, uneducated, stupid and narrowminded as they have been 10or 20 years ago. The only thing that changed in my humble opinion is, now they have the means of calling for help. Which is as we already figured out a double edged sword.

Maybe you have access not only to the deployment figures that as we already heard increased drastically because of the cellphones, but also to the mountain casualty numbers, and if they increasead or decreasedcompared to like 20 years ago?

[Silverback]

Yes but 20 years ago you were forced to send someone for help or get out of the situation on your own....nowadays its far too easy to pick up the moby, which is no bad thing in serious cases where a genuine injury has happened.

I will have a dig around for some statistics....and contact my Bergwacht friends

[MadZ]

personally i dont like taking my phone out, but one use for a dead mobile phone battery if its lithium is that you can use it to start fire by driving your knife into it, it will start to pop and fizzle up due to a chemical reaction with the oxygen, chuck on your tinder and you should get fire, i think bear gryls done this in one of his episodes before so you might be able to find it on you tube, sorry if this post is a bit off of the topic

[ADz]

Even I know this advert is just silly/bad advise............


http://i.imgur.com/C40taNb.png

[Dave ward]

I think this subject falls into certain groups, and im no expert at all but if you are going to venture out on to the moors/hills then you SHOULD have some level of map and compass skills. Now I understand there are a few people who may one day just get up and go for a hill walk ill prepared but thats what there are, ill prepared and as a consequence people will be injured or worse. I think that if mounting rescue are called out to individuals then they should be made to go on a training course in map readings, maybe ran by the government to repay the cost of the call out similar to if you get caught speeding, points on the licence or made to pay to dodge the points and go and spend a few hours learning what your action can cause etc

[Silverback]

I think that if mounting rescue are called out to individuals then they should be made to go on a training course in map readings, maybe ran by the government to repay the cost of the call out similar to if you get caught speeding, points on the licence or made to pay to dodge the points and go and spend a few hours learning what your action can cause etc

Remember the main cost of the call out is bourne by the MR members in lost wages, fuel, vehicle wear and tear, and of course that most important resource...time. Interestingly enough if you straw poll most volunteer SAR folks they will almost all say that they reject the idea of insurances and making folks pay for rescue and that the investment should be in training, education and information - not punishment.

Air Ambulances dont cost the government a penny and the only other asset called for a non injury misper would be a Police officer or two because they have the statutory responsibility for missing / lost persons.

Unless a SAR helo is mobilised then the cost to the taxpayer is relatively low as military SAR Helos come out of the defence budget and HMCG Helos come out of the CG Budget which we sign up to by international SAR agreement.

Lastly the final thing anyone would want is government interference in something that has worked for the last 80 years, with the exception of some tax breaks. Why should the government get a penny in repayment for the cost of something that they get for free at point of delivery ?

[Dave ward]

Um yes I see your point sapper when put like that, as I say im no expert on the matter and if the guys on the ground would sooner the money go towards training and such things then who are we to say differently. They are the guys and gals doing the difficult job. I do think mobiles can be a great help in an emergency but they should be used as a last ditch item when you really are in the you know what ha ha go to the map 1st and dont panic, 7 p's! :)

[Silverback]

They are the guys and gals doing the difficult job.:)

Yup...the team I'm a member of had 3 jobs yesterday alone....

[Dave ward]

3 jobs...is that a average days call out rate? I bet alot of people were not prepared for the heat yesterday.

[Silverback]

3 jobs...is that a average days call out rate? I bet alot of people were not prepared for the heat yesterday.

No....its getting busier but theres no way of predicting the jobs unless youre in one of the honeypot areas like Edale for example. Yesterday was Tuesday, 3 calls in a day at a weekend maybe, but on a tuesday go figure !!

Some teams manage 300 jobs plus a year, some do less than 20.....ours did 70 odd last year i think.....however put that on top of working full time and you can see how much call outs impact on the lives of Volunteer SAR members.

[Dave ward]

Thats a high number for in the week then. You can definitely see the strain it puts on people, especially as a call could come in at any time in 24hours!

[Silverback]

Thats a high number for in the week then. You can definitely see the strain it puts on people, especially as a call could come in at any time in 24hours!

Yup and with the increased reliance on the Volunteer SAR services in large scale resillience incidents the hours can be long before you go to work the next day. The flood incidents in the last 5 years were a prime example where in Cumbria MR members helped folks out of their homes whilst their own homes were flooded, and in Yorkshire the guys and girls were out till 0500 then it was home showered and into work for those that couldnt swing the day off.

For some the call outs arent just local, many will respond to accidents or incidents as part of their holidays and daily routine and many are called to 'out of area' incidents, particularly searches - the recent search April Jones is a perfect example of this with MR teams sending search sections to Wales from all points of the compass, Search and Rescue Dogs are recognised as a national resource and can be deployed anywhere (within reason)


....and we should now really get this thread back on track

[Dave ward]

The best thing about having your mobile on you when out and about is being able to take pics and videos and share them on here for us all to have a ganda at. (Yes cheesy I know ha ha)

[Corbeau]

Agreed, as long as you have a spare battery to call someone in a real emergency...

[FishyFolk]

Remember the main cost of the call out is bourne by the MR members in lost wages, fuel, vehicle wear and tear, and of course that most important resource...time. Interestingly enough if you straw poll most volunteer SAR folks they will almost all say that they reject the idea of insurances and making folks pay for rescue and that the investment should be in training, education and information - not punishment.

Air Ambulances dont cost the government a penny and the only other asset called for a non injury misper would be a Police officer or two because they have the statutory responsibility for missing / lost persons.

Unless a SAR helo is mobilised then the cost to the taxpayer is relatively low as military SAR Helos come out of the defence budget and HMCG Helos come out of the CG Budget which we sign up to by international SAR agreement.

Lastly the final thing anyone would want is government interference in something that has worked for the last 80 years, with the exception of some tax breaks. Why should the government get a penny in repayment for the cost of something that they get for free at point of delivery ?

When doing some googling for our discussion on the subject, I saw an intersting quote from one of the higher ups in the Norwegian Red Cross Rescue Services. This was an article about the problem of people calling recue becasue they where tired, having blisters etc. And what he said was that they encouraged a low treshold for contacting rescue services.

But then they are better funded than you in England it would seem...

[Silverback]

This was an article about the problem of people calling recue becasue they where tired, having blisters etc. And what he said was that they encouraged a low treshold for contacting rescue services.



Exactly...so Rescue services in two countries echo similar sentiments.....

[FishyFolk]

Exactly...so Rescue services in two countries echo similar sentiments.....

I think maybe you misunderstood, or that I was not clear enough. The NRCRS is encouraging/ promoting that people should have a low treshold for calling rescue services. They want them to call sooner, rather than later.

[Silverback]

Interesting.........

[FishyFolk]

What is interesting is that over the last 5 years they have seen a rapid increase in what they call "fetching" call outs. I.e people that have walked themselves further into the hills than they can cope with.I.e to exhausted to make it back on their own.
If it was up to me, I'd just confirm that they where equipped and had food enough to stay out, and ask them to rest up and get som food into themselves, general advice like that. And only send someone to bring them in, if it where some nobs not equipped to be where they where. But it would appear they help everyone get back...but I guess the risk is that if they had an accident after reciving the advice to rest up, someone would blame the rescue services for not "doing something"...

[Silverback]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-north-west-wales-23801997

another cautionary tale

[jus_young]

It will never change unfortunately, the human race is just too stupid.

[Rasputin]

Ive got to agree, id never go on the hills without a mobile, but chances are when I needed it would be the time with no signal. Much better to make sure someone will miss you if you dont return by a set time, and leave them details of the route you would be taking.

T^

[Rasputin]

As stated a mobile should only be one tool in your safety precautions. But this video is worth a watch to make it a little more effective in some circumstances.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XPZv_8dABfU

Very Interesting thanks for sharing, Ken

[MadZ]

this is the kind of point i was trying to get across in the iphone apps thread, its ridiculous that people can be so retarded when it comes navigation, packing of there kit and the i'm alright jack attitude

rescue teams should be allowed to give people that do this kind of thing a swift kick in the backside, pretty sure they would pack a map and compass after receiving a steel toe cap to the rear.

good video that, registered my phone with them just now just in case and got them on speed dial, hopefully i will never need to use it, but accidents can happen to the best of us.

cheers

MadZ

[Craig_88]

I take a basic one not my smart phone as it has extended life and it's just there for either me calling for assistance if needed or people need to get in touch with me. Other than that it doesn't come out of the pack.

[Silverback]

rescue teams should be allowed to give people that do this kind of thing a swift kick in the backside, pretty sure they would pack a map and compass after receiving a steel toe cap to the rear.


Who says they dont ? Kind of defeats the charitable objects of the rescue teams though......;)

[MadZ]

now i know where all these concussed hikers are coming from :happy-clapping:

been toying with the idea of contacting the nearest srt team or closest equivalent to see if i could volunteer myself, i guess there always on the look out for another helping hand??

any chance of some advice on whats required, equipment, personal skill levels etc, would be very much appreciated if any of you are in the know and would not mind pointing me in the right direction.

cheers

Madz

[Silverback]

First question.....where do you live ? That decides which service is closest ie Mountain Rescue, Lowland Rescue or CG SAR

[MadZ]

swindon, wiltshire


Sapper cheers for replying

Madz

[Silverback]

That's makes it lowland rescue then. Not sure on their exact requirements for membership more info here

http://www.alsar.org.uk/

[MadZ]

legend sapper thank you

Edit: downloaded the trainee application form for WILSAR, we will see where it leads, thanks again sapper

[Silverback]

Hope you have plenty of time and money because it will eat both....particularly money not just in kit but in fuel

[MadZ]

time will not be an issue, money maybe be a slight issue due to a young and growing family, but i know a fair few guys that would happily donate me there kit if they knew what the cause was.

basically i want to do something worth while and i believe this is it, if i can make a difference just once then i would be happy, i have noticed from the news and media coverage that there are more and more people in my area that get them selves into issues and from looking at the WILSAR site i think this is for me hands down

cant thank you enough for pointing me in the right direction, I'll keep you posted on what comes of it if anything cheers

Madz

[Silverback]

i have noticed from the news and media coverage that there are more and more people in my area that get them selves into issues and from looking at the WILSAR site i think this is for me hands down


The 'issues' are many and complicated... I have seen, carried, and recovered by various means more dead folks, in various states of decomposition in 2 months (never mind the near 14 years i have served) than most people will see in a lifetime. I'm not trying to put you off but dealing with the aftermath of these things is something you may want to consider too. OK sure folks get lost, but the unseen and very real face of SAR is looking for dementia/alzheimers patients, runaways, despondents/the suicidal, and in extremis there is the possibility of getting involved in criminal investigations and the media circus that follows it around.

Hopefully you will be given all this info on first approach...I have some mates in ALSAR so if you need info just drop me a PM

[MadZ]

these are things that i have considered, thanks for your concerns though, i have had dealings with the dead in more ways than one, though its not nice and does have a toll on you mentally, physically and emotionally, i feel that those stresses on the family and other people involved greatly out weigh my own, this is partly the reason i decided to follow this route, its been on my mind for a few years now, and from seeing the things posted here about peoples issues etc its set the ball rolling.

hopefully i will meet there criteria and be accepted into there ranks in one way or another.

i will certainly give you a shout if i need any other info, thank you again for your time and patience

cheers

Madz

[Fraser]

As stated a mobile should only be one tool in your safety precautions. But this video is worth a watch to make it a little more effective in some circumstances.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XPZv_8dABfU
Excellent video man, thanks for sharing. I agree that a mobile phone in this case is an emergency piece of equipment and should only be used in an emergency situation. ANYONE going out there without suitable kit, clothing, maps, compass and suitable skills and knowledge needs their heads read.


Out of curiosity, how many members have an I.C.E. number in the contact on their mobile?

I have 3..... The wifes mobile, the House and my brothers mobile.

[OakAshandThorn]

http://www.arcamax.com/thefunnies/wizardofid/s-1384293 :p

[midas]

As stated a mobile should only be one tool in your safety precautions. But this video is worth a watch to make it a little more effective in some circumstances.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XPZv_8dABfU

Thank you,for that most interesting "Tutorial",one learns something new every day!spend time in Wanlockhead/Leadhills,D & G.were coverage isnt great.!

[midas]

Bump

[NorthernYeti]

I HAD ICE WHEN I HAD A PHONE, ive been phone free for 3 years now i have a small radio for emergencys

[Midge_Fodder]

I have to say yes they are good in an emergency. You don't need a signal to phone for an emergency service. Still wouldn't trust it as my only means. However the camera has came in handy on occasion.

[Midge_Fodder]

Thank you,for that most interesting "Tutorial",one learns something new every day!spend time in Wanlockhead/Leadhills,D & G.were coverage isnt great.!

Tell me about it lol