A hyperthetical question.................

[SimonB]

Ok, here goes.

Imagine it all went pear shaped.... WW3 is off and running, with ICBM's dropping all over.

Now, say you live near somewhere with natural underground systems,and you decide to go and start living in the deep caves, (Peak district is my example),and boom, one drops on the city ..

Now, I know that if caught up on top, everyone would be a pile of ashes,but how much protection does folk think you would get from being down in the caves, and would the water seeping through some rocks,(Normally good to drink), become contaminated?

Like I say, purely hyperthetical, I just want to see different peoples views..


Cheers,

Si.

[Silverback]

http://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/library/policy/army/fm/3-4/Ch4.htm

[woodsman]

From what I have read on the subject, it is recommended to use an earth filter to remove the radioactive material.
How this compares with filtering through rocks I don't know, but I guess it would depend on the type of rock as some are more
porous than others and might not do as good a job. I think I would do both just in case.

[Fraxinus]

I don't think I'd want to be around after such a cataclysmic event so would go for a final paddle (kayak) and let the sea take me when I'm cooked. Heck! I might even get a tan at last too.;)

Rob.

P.S. I am not good at being underground, went down a mine in Germany once..done it got the T-shirt, ain't gonna do it by choice again.:guns:

[Silverback]

Simon....BLOT, BANG, RUB mate...

[SimonB]

Simon....BLOT, BANG, RUB mate...

I remember the drill fella... And I also know how much they taught us was pure bs..... A noddy suite will not protect you from the heat of a blast in lying down in a ditch... I'd be well done on one side... :) The trenches are nowt more than a glorified, self dug grave...

[Silverback]

I remember the drill fella... And I also know how much they taught us was pure bs..... A noddy suite will not protect you from the heat of a blast in lying down in a ditch... I'd be well done on one side... :) The trenches are nowt more than a glorified, self dug grave...

'When you hear the air attack warning you and your family must take cover'...Yeah in the fall out room we made from doors and suitcases...just another way of keeping folks off the streets and not having to bury them as they burn in the remains of the house...

The cold war was very real to us 'old uns' wasnt it ?

[SimonB]

'When you hear the air attack warning you and your family must take cover'...Yeah in the fall out room we made from doors and suitcases...just another way of keeping folks off the streets and not having to bury them as they burn in the remains of the house...

The cold war was very real to us 'old uns' wasnt it ?

Yep, a very real threat... But with the way things are going, the fear factor back then might just return.. The new Gorbachov and Raegan.... Putin and Obama...
Throw in Gangham man from Korea, and it could get very nasty.... Sryia, China, middle east, it's all getting to that point where threats will be issued.

[Silverback]

Yep, a very real threat... But with the way things are going, the fear factor back then might just return.. The new Gorbachov and Raegan.... Putin and Obama...
Throw in Gangham man from Korea, and it could get very nasty.... Sryia, China, middle east, it's all getting to that point where threats will be issued.

Not to worry though mate....we have TOWIE and X Factor to numb the pain now

[Tigger004]

Simon....BLOT, BANG, RUB mate...

two of those three sound appealing, depends on who else is around.....definitely go out with a bang if possible.

[SimonB]

two of those three sound appealing, depends on who else is around.....definitely go out with a bang if possible.


It's the decontamination proceedure mate, using pads of fullers earth...

[SimonB]

Not to worry though mate....we have TOWIE and X Factor to numb the pain now


I think I'd rather ride the warhead down than watch that tripe...... LOL

[FishyFolk]

'When you hear the air attack warning you and your family must take cover'...Yeah in the fall out room we made from doors and suitcases...just another way of keeping folks off the streets and not having to bury them as they burn in the remains of the house...

The cold war was very real to us 'old uns' wasnt it ?

My only plan consist of sticking my head between my thighs, make a final gesture, and kiss my .... goodbye...

Else:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I2UpM8Ci_ao

[Fraxinus]

Not to worry though mate....we have TOWIE and X Factor to numb the pain now

I'm off for a paddle......................

[SimonB]

My only plan consist of sticking my head between my thighs, make a final gesture, and kiss my .... goodbye...

Else:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I2UpM8Ci_ao


:happy-clapping: T^

[Sar-ian]

I think I'd rather ride the warhead down than watch that tripe...... LOL

me tooo.............

[Rasputin]

I think I'd rather ride the warhead down than watch that tripe...... LOL

Now that is an absolute fact no sane person can argue, T^

[Rasputin]

My only plan consist of sticking my head between my thighs, make a final gesture, and kiss my .... goodbye...

Else:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I2UpM8Ci_ao

:happy-clapping: T^

[Rasputin]

I remember PIF's on TV, even as a kid they made me laugh. I dont have any firm views on it my self TBH, other than we should make the politicians fight as they cause the probs.

[bigpaul]

conventional nuclear war hasn't been on the cards for decades, its M.A.D., nobody wins, now a high level burst that takes out all the infrastructure is another thing.

[janso]

Tactical nukes or high level EMP are the probable options; M.A.D just doesn't make sense anymore, why irradiate your enemies equipment when you can take it! Besides, as long as the oil is intact, would any superpower care??!

[Midge_Fodder]

To be honest it's not nuke but bio I'd be worried about, nuke I'm dead and can't do anything about it, biological is a whole lot scarier than that in my opinion.

[rawfish111]

Aye an exo-atmospheric blast is a possibility and in my view the most likely scenario.... unless Obama pushes the wrong desk button when trying to order its morning coffee.

Exo-atmospheric blast creating a massive EMP will see us finding out how to live in reality once again. Without the idiot box in the corner of the living room and some folks might even learn to use a map again!

Just have to feel for those hooked to machines in hospitals as I don't think they are stormproofed.

[Rasputin]

I remember the drill fella... And I also know how much they taught us was pure bs..... A noddy suite will not protect you from the heat of a blast in lying down in a ditch... I'd be well done on one side... :) The trenches are nowt more than a glorified, self dug grave...

T^

[Rasputin]

Not to worry though mate....we have TOWIE and X Factor to numb the pain now

And boy are they numbing on every level

[Rasputin]

My only plan consist of sticking my head between my thighs, make a final gesture, and kiss my .... goodbye...

Else:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I2UpM8Ci_ao

T^

[Silverback]

Be under no illusion if Putins army go on tour there would be little we could do especially if China joined in too - Their conventional forces are plentiful enough and sophisticated enough

[bigpaul]

Just have to feel for those hooked to machines in hospitals as I don't think they are stormproofed. if the SHTF anyone with a lifethreatening illness, the very old, the infirm and the very young have probably all had it anyway :Sorry:

[TheDogsSlave]

Aye an exo-atmospheric blast is a possibility and in my view the most likely scenario.... unless Obama pushes the wrong desk button when trying to order its morning coffee.

Exo-atmospheric blast creating a massive EMP will see us finding out how to live in reality once again. Without the idiot box in the corner of the living room and some folks might even learn to use a map again!

Just have to feel for those hooked to machines in hospitals as I don't think they are stormproofed.

I just read "Lights Out", based on very similar circumstances - good book!

[David_JAFO]

hello,
Due to HM Armed Forces cut backs Britain's contribution to NATO Ukraine crisis. I made this earlier :wink:
Regards
David

11799

[David_JAFO]

hello,
Simon B I know we went kind of O.T but yes I've done a 28 days+ stint in a Bunker more than once, without coming outside. rationing water purification etc.. similar to what you were hypothetically discussing. I suppose in a cave system taking into consideration the loss of creature comforts, damp living conditions, ailments from such etc.. I'm sure there would be a few who would be heading to take their chances outside rather than such conditions. It ain't easy BTW ok a 24-48 hour NBC kit dug into a trench exercise scenario etc.. try it longer term :confused2:
Regards
David

[Silverback]

I've done 28 days above ground in Three Romeo oh and that was doing physical work ....flippinng Crab Air !

[Midge_Fodder]

hello,
Simon B I know we went kind of O.T but yes I've done a 28 days+ stint in a Bunker more than once, without coming outside. rationing water purification etc.. similar to what you were hypothetically discussing. I suppose in a cave system taking into consideration the loss of creature comforts, damp living conditions, ailments from such etc.. I'm sure there would be a few who would be heading to take their chances outside rather than such conditions. It ain't easy BTW ok a 24-48 hour NBC kit dug into a trench exercise scenario etc.. try it longer term :confused2:
Regards
David

I think in the long run you'd probably shuffle off your mortal coil, assisted with some lead. To be honest dark damp living conditions are going to cause depression in the long term. Also humans are social creatures, without social interaction and natural light, your already playing with fire.

[bigpaul]

oh god how many times have I heard that " humans are social animals"?? not all of us are, I prefer to be away from people, solitude is the ideal for me cant stand crowds.

[TheDogsSlave]

I'm not really a people person either, but some company is good for morale. I'd be happy with just my OH and my dog.

[Midge_Fodder]

No don't get me wrong I'm as anti social as the rest of you, but why do you think solitary is used in the penal system. Being on your own for large periods of time with literally no company will drive you mad, especially in those conditions.

[bigpaul]

depends on the company, some people are BAD for morale, give me an animal any day.

[bigpaul]

No don't get me wrong I'm as anti social as the rest of you, but why do you think solitary is used in the penal system. Being on your own for large periods of time with literally no company will drive you mad, especially in those conditions.

not me buddy, I THRIVE on being away from people, spent most of my childhood and a big chunk of my adult life alone, I prefer to be alone.

[Midge_Fodder]

Aye that's a fair point.

[TheDogsSlave]

give me an animal any day.

You want to be careful how you say that :D but I take your point, in the main animals are far better company than most people.

[Silverback]

not me buddy, I THRIVE on being away from people, spent most of my childhood and a big chunk of my adult life alone, I prefer to be alone.

But seem to be by your own admission a ' virtual ' social animal... by frequenting and being well know on lots of forums...

[bigpaul]

But seem to be by your own admission a ' virtual ' social animal... by frequenting and being well know on lots of forums...

that's not really the same as being in a group situation is it? and its mostly prepper related anyway. I don't speak to anyone I know for months at a time(excluding the dog and the wife that is).

[Silverback]

Its still a form of communication..last figures I saw 90 percent of all human communication is non verbal

[bigpaul]

yeah most of them just grunt !!!:tongue sorry if I'm not actually with someone(as in standing next to them) then I don't think I'm being a "social animal", a comment typed on a page is like sending a letter.

[Silverback]

yeah most of them just grunt !!!:tongue

I'm sure the million odd sign language users of the UK would appreciate that comment

[Silverback]

a comment typed on a page is like sending a letter.

Its still a form of communication and a lot more instant than a letter. The very fact you have a wife and a dog confirms you as a social animal, you just chose which people and animals to socialise with..if you were really anti social then surely ypou would live conpletely alone and away fron human contact full stop....and I bet you talk to your dog...I know I do

[bigpaul]

Its still a form of communication and a lot more instant than a letter. The very fact you have a wife and a dog confirms you as a social animal, you just chose which people and animals to socialise with..if you were really anti social then surely ypou would live conpletely alone and away fron human contact full stop....and I bet you talk to your dog...I know I do

yes I do, I even been known to talk to the wife on the odd occasion!!:mad2: as for being anti social, I've always said that if I woke up one morning and I was the last human left alive I'd be a happy chappie and in my element, I would happily live the rest of my life on my own.

[Silverback]

I was the last human left alive I'd be a happy chappie and in my element, I would happily live the rest of my life on my own.

You have the ability to do that and live in total solitude but haven't done so..preferring to live with another human and socilaise on the internet - your more social than you care to admit...ok nbot as social as Tony Benn but still choosing to contact and be around other humans....and as for me I'm off to feed my ferrets

[bigpaul]

suit yourself I know what I mean.

[David_JAFO]

hello,
Simon I still say it would drive most people insane. Try stopping in doors without windows or daylight & only going between the living room, kitchen, bedroom, & bathroom no venturing outside for a month a few hundred feet underground or in former ROC Posts a depth of 24ft from the hatch to sump grid/ground. Communication from within the inner sanctum SOPs would be limited to communication between point A & B outwith in the same circumstances sub terrain dwelling with the odd bit of chat. Once the blast doors closed that is it. BTW regardless of being a close knit group within such dwellings, yes you can get on each others bits.. but that's something that has to be over come. I suppose in these deep caverns sub terrain habitats natural in the hard rock as per your question, that would have added strains & stress on the human body & mind, there would be some water that's uncontaminated pending if it was running beneath the water table ground level or spring like filling a pool it could be drinkable. I suppose filtration through rock etc.. from above may well remove some contaminants. The water would certainly taste very earthy or of iron anyway. Lets hope that it never has to be put to the test for real eh?
Regards
David

[Rasputin]

You have the ability to do that and live in total solitude but haven't done so..preferring to live with another human and socilaise on the internet - your more social than you care to admit...ok nbot as social as Tony Benn but still choosing to contact and be around other humans....and as for me I'm off to feed my ferrets

T^

[bigpaul]

hello,
I still say it would drive most people insane. Try stopping in doors without windows or daylight & only going between the living room, kitchen, bedroom, & bathroo
David

sounds like one of the bedsits I used to live in!!:evilgrin:

[janso]

The social dilemma! As a race we do need companionship and even contact with others; it's the basis for tribes and clans having mutual aid. Being in your own? How long until you need help due to injury, illness, etc? I'm all for having 'me time' but in a hypothetical grid down scenario, I'm all about numbers for safety, security and support. No one going alone in history has lasted long...

[Silverback]

The social dilemma! As a race we do need companionship and even contact with others; it's the basis for tribes and clans having mutual aid. Being in your own? How long until you need help due to injury, illness, etc? I'm all for having 'me time' but in a hypothetical grid down scenario, I'm all about numbers for safety, security and support. No one going alone in history has lasted long...

Well put and absolutely in the money

[Midge_Fodder]

Exactly, summed up it's our history of sticking together that created civilisation in the first place. More to the point if everyone works together, we have all the skills we need. Some people are amazingly skilled at hunting and fishing, others can build a fire in any weather imaginable, and some might be a dab hand at repairs to the vital kit we need to survive. We stand a far better chance working as a team as we do struggling on your own.

[bigpaul]

that's fine if you can join a group/clan/tribe you can trust, but unless you have lots of friends/relatives living nearby this may be harder than you think, post SHTF you wont be able to just go up to a preformed group and say "yoohoo, I want to join" you'll probably be run off at the working end of a shotgun! people will be very suspicious of strangers post collapse, this may be harder to do than anyone thinks. personally I'm not putting my trust(and survival) in the hands of complete strangers. like I said before we aren't all social animals.

[Silverback]

He's a Scot...clans are in his blood

[bigpaul]

maybe so, I'm a suspicious so and so!:mad2:

[Silverback]

According to this blogger many are going to die despite prepping

http://www.prepperfortress.com/why-many-preppers-will-die/

[bigpaul]

prepping is only a means to an end, food supplies are only meant to last about 12 months or so whilst we hunker down or bug out to avoid the initial mayhem.

[bigpaul]

prepping is only a means to an end, food supplies are NOT meant to last the rest of our lives, they are for the period whilst we hunker down to avoid the initial mayhem, usually about 12 months.

[Davepr]

Hi guys take a good watch of this series of vids from the tube. http://m.youtube.com/watch?list=PLRp6eITyg_nla6QvkcLuK4W3ekzfLyeRE&v=6kOU0uusKPE

[Chubbs]

This film really brought it home for some when it was shown in the eighties. I was an eighties teenager and it was the talking point at school after it was shown.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5AUYCnzmDJY

Very dated now but well worth a watch.

[Silverback]

Threads......grand film and I have had the pleasure of working with one of the actors in that film but in one of his more 'famous' roles

[rik_uk3]

+1 for threads and for those who've not seen it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrGg8PfkbZw

Harrowing to watch.